Yet another news story came out yesterday stating that some scientists believe that homosexuality might be biologically determined. Now of course any study into something we're not sure about is welcome, it's part of the human experience to be curious about the unknown.
But does the cause of homosexuality really have a bearing on our pleas for equality? I personally don't think so. My freedom as an individual to do whatever I like with my body as long it doesn't harm anyone, and it's completely consensual, is paramount. Who I choose to love is irrelevant to the Government or society in general. I'm bored of people using the nature versus nurture debate in arguments over gay rights and freedoms. The following part of the BBC article is what really pissed me off.
Andy Forrest, a spokesman for gay rights group Stonewall, said: Increasingly, credible evidence appears to indicate that being gay is genetically determined rather than being a so-called lifestyle choice.
It adds further weight to the argument that lesbian and gay people should be treated equally in society and not discriminated against for something that's just as inherent as skin colour
OK.... so what you're saying there is if being gay is just a unique character trait somehow our fight to be treated equally is hurt? What the Hell? If our argument for being treated like any other human being relies in whole, or in part, on whether we're "natural" *scoff* or not we might as well give up. Not exactly taking the moral high ground, more a hopeless crotch for a losing point of view.
We deserve to be treated equally because we are human beings who are doing nothing wrong. We are not, as a group, hellbent on the destruction of the planet. We are not paedophiles. We are not in the business of recruiting (no matter how much we might joke we are!). We are just like everybody else. Some of us are fucking bastards and some of us are not. Strange, gay men are just the same as everyone else... we're all unique and different!
Now you can quote that being gay is unhealthy (what's that got to do with you? I believe in health insurance, if we pay our way get over it!), is likely to lead to mental problems (more likely the mental problems are caused by bigotry, real or perceived), and is not right by the Bible (trust me there's a lot of prohibited things in there that no one seems to worry about, read it and see! And what has your Bible got to do with me?) but I stand firm behind my beliefs... homosexuality, whether it's a choice, a reality or an illusion, should not be a basis for discrimination.
Interesting argument. But why is consent of ultimate importance? If you and I decide to have a duel (ten paces, turn, and shoot) we are consenting--but does that mean it's okay?
ReplyDelete(This is completely irrelevant to the discussion, but I think dueling should be legal.)
As a libertarian I would probably say yes, but with a proviso the loser had to clean up the mess so as not to disturb anyone else too greatly...
ReplyDeleteAnd if at all possible it should all happen somewhere I don't need to see it.
Consents important for the obvious reason that rape is an interference in personal freedoms... and pretty bloody abhorrent to boot.
I agree with you, Jae. And to think that the quote came from the spokesperson for a gay rights group!
ReplyDeleteThe research being quoted in the article isn't all that new. I posted about it several months ago. And I think Professor Bogaert, author of the study, overplays the importance of the study. Sexuality is way too complicated--biologically as well as socially--to be determined by any one factor.
I see your point, and think it's a good one. However, it makes sense to me that most gay-rights advocates tend to frame their arguments in regards to what their opponents are saying. Gay people should be able to have the same rights as everyone else regardless of the origins of their homosexuality. However, fundamentalists continue to attack this by claiming, contrary to all dependable scientific and medical/psychiatric studies done in the last 30 odd years, that homosexuality is a deviant sexual behavior akin to pedophilia. Is it any wonder then, that the gay rights movement continues to try to address this issue? Taking the moral high ground and arguing that gay people deserve to be treated as human beings regardless is all well and good, however, moral high ground tends to fly out the window when your actual civil liberties are being threatened. I don't know if this is a big problem in the UK, but here in the U.S. we actually have lawmakers actively trying to curtail the freedoms of gay americans, saying they can't get married, can't adopt children, can be fired for being gay, etc.
ReplyDeleteOk, sorry for the long winded rant. I'm passionate about this subject somewhat. And today is, after all the anniversary of the Stonewall Riots.
Being gay.
ReplyDeleteIt's either by choice or by nature.
If its by nature, its a defect, just like a baby with 3 arms.
We still love the baby but its not 'normal'.
That's such a hideously mean statement there Senor, but you're entitled to your opinion.
ReplyDeleteBut I don't see how it adds to the debate, considering it really doesn't matter whether being gay is "normal" or not... We still deserve equal treatment... you don't sack someone from a job because they were born with three arms, you don't beat them up for being a freak, you don't say you can't marry someone else who was born with three arms. And in polite company you don't go up to them and say "I love you, but you aren't normal".
Interesting article as always.
ReplyDeleteI fully agree with you Jae.
I guess the debate over the two is far more relevant to those who are biblical literalists and on that basis I'm all for research that gives us more ammunition against them.
My father was born in 1928 and went to school in the 1930s. According to my 86-year-old left handed aunt, my father was left-handed but was beaten at school for being left handed, because it was seen as not natural, sinister, a manifestation of the devil. My father stammered all the years I knew him (He died at 60, when I was 20). A well-known cause of stammering is having lefthandedness beaten out of one.
ReplyDeleteFast forward to 2006. No one gets beaten for being left handed. I am right handed and regard lefthandedness as different, minority, but normal. Like redheadedness. I also think that homosexuality is a bit like lefthandedness or redheadedness (although there is spectrum of gayness/gingerness whereas handedness tends to be exclusively binary).
Senor -
ReplyDeleteHomosexuality is a normal part of human behaviour and is therefore not defective.
Almost every intelligent researcher has come to the conclusion that it's biological in origin, even though your personal prejudices may cause you to choose to ignore the overwhelming weight of evidence.
Defective is a word you should use more carefully - maybe when speaking about a television set that doesn't work. It doesn't apply to people who are all different. Some people are born with red hair and freckles and some people are born with no sight - just because they are in a minority it doesn't mean they are defective.
OK.... so what you're saying there is if being gay is just a unique character trait somehow our fight to be treated equally is hurt?
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure how you managed to read it that way. I looked over it a few times to make sure I didn't miss something and still can't find your conclusion.
Andy Forrest, a spokesman for gay rights group Stonewall, said: Increasingly, credible evidence appears to indicate that being gay is genetically determined rather than being a so-called lifestyle choice.
It adds further weight to the argument that lesbian and gay people should be treated equally in society and not discriminated against for something that's just as inherent as skin colour
By "weight" they mean more streghth to the arguement for gays rights, not trouble. The referring to skin color was a reaffirming of the civil rights argument that many gay rights activist have insisted upon.
I understand your overall point though. That by excepting arguments of what is "natural" or not, you offer validity to the moral argument. The problem is… that is the major argument. That is what’s deciding anti same-sex marriage laws.
If you want to do anything about the legal and constitution discrimination that is being imposed upon gay people, you have to hit the issue from as many sides as you can to reach as many voters and congressmen as possible.
Ignoring/dismissing the arena is luxury of the majority.
Peace.
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ReplyDelete